Brock Thorvaldson

First-time buyers driving force in Canada’s residential real estate markets, says RE/MAX

Brock Thorvaldson — Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:55:00 GMT

March 11, 2009

Kelowna, BC (March 11, 2009) --   A report released today by RE/MAX confirms that entry-level purchasers are now the engine driving home-buying activity in almost every major centre in Canada.

The 2009 RE/MAX First-Time Buyers Report, highlighting first-time buying activity in 32 residential housing markets across Canada, found that improved affordability is prompting many first-time buyers to get off the fence, out of the rental, and into the market.   While a sense of caution still prevails, more and more first-timers are finding it hard to pass up the chance to become homeowners in today’s buyer-centric real estate climate. Increased inventory and longer days on market coupled with the lowest lending rates ever are presenting opportunities that have not been seen in almost a decade.

“Canadian markets from coast-to-coast are ripe for a reawakening as the weather warms up,” says Elton Ash, Regional Executive Vice President, RE/MAX of Western Canada. “First-time buyers seem more acclimatized to economic factors, even though the barrage of bad news continues to flow.   Those who are secure in their jobs, have accumulated good down payments, and have acceptable credit ratings are continuing to venture forward, undeterred by tighter lending criteria.”

Although the year got off to a slow start, February home sales were well ahead of those reported in January. The upward trending is expected to continue as more and more first-time buyers enter the market in the weeks ahead. The flurry of activity in the lower-end may also serve to kick-start sales in the mid-to-upper end of the market, which have, as expected, been relatively sluggish in recent months. While inventory and days on market was up virtually across the board, it’s noteworthy that several markets reported tighter conditions in the lower end of the market, where demand and buyer activity remains quite healthy.

“While the current economic crisis has caused some first-time buyers to either take it slowly or apply the brakes, home ownership remains a top priority for those who are able to take advantage of reduced carrying costs, rock bottom interest rates and lower house prices,” explains Michael Polzler, Executive Vice President and Regional Director, RE/MAX Ontario-Atlantic Canada. “Affordability has greatly improved and buyers are firmly in the drivers’ seat in just about every market we surveyed. The new reality is that homeownership remains well within reach for most first-time buyers.”

According to the RE/MAX Report, buyers are clearly in control in most Canadian markets. Of the 32 markets surveyed, 22 (69 per cent) remain firmly in buyer’s market territory. These include Vancouver, Surrey, Port Coquitlam, Chilliwack, Kelowna, Victoria, Edmonton, Calgary, Saskatoon, Regina, Ottawa, Peterborough, London-St. Thomas, Niagara Falls, Mississauga, Metro Toronto, Northern GTA, Kingston, Windsor, Hamilton-Burlington, Barrie, and Halifax-Dartmouth. Ten (31 per cent) report more balanced conditions: Winnipeg, Kitchener-Waterloo, Sudbury, North Bay, St. Catharines, Saint John, Moncton, Fredericton, St. John’s, and Charlottetown.

Forty per cent of markets offered single-detached homes priced under $200,000, including Charlottetown, Saint John, Moncton, Peterborough, Niagara Falls, St. Catharines, Windsor, Fredericton, Halifax-Dartmouth, London, North Bay, Kingston, Saskatoon and Winnipeg. More than two-thirds (71 per cent) offered condominiums starting under $200,000, (Moncton, Fredericton, Halifax-Dartmouth, Sudbury, North Bay, Peterborough, Mississauga, Burlington, Niagara Falls, St. Catharines, Kitchener-Waterloo, London, Windsor, Surrey, Chilliwack, Victoria, Kelowna, Edmonton, Saskatoon, Regina, and Winnipeg).

The most affordable markets for detached homes, based on starting prices are: Moncton ($115,000), Charlottetown ($120,000), and Saint John ($130,000) in Eastern Canada; Windsor ($75,000), Niagara Falls ($119,000), and St. Catharines ($125,000) in Ontario; Winnipeg ($185,000), Saskatoon ($190,000), and Regina ($210,000) in Western Canada.

RE/MAX is Canada’s leading real estate organization with over 17,000 sales associates situated throughout its more than 670 independently-owned and operated offices across the country. The RE/MAX franchise network, now in its 36^th year, is a global real estate system operating in more than 70 countries. Over 6,800 independently-owned offices engage nearly 100,000 member sales associates who lead the industry in professional designations, experience and production while providing real estate services in resident, commercial, referral, and asset management. For more information, visit: www.remax.ca

Homebuyers Benefit from Lower Prices

Brock Thorvaldson — Thu, 19 Feb 2009 19:30:00 GMT

For the complete news release, including detailed statistics, follow this link: www.bcrea.bc.ca/news_room/2008-11.pdf.

For immediate release

Homebuyers Benefit from Lower Prices

Vancouver, BC – December 12, 2008. British Columbia Real Estate Association (BCREA) reports residential sales dollar volume on the Multiple Listing Service® (MLS®) in BC declined 67 per cent to $1.07 billion in November, compared to November 2007. Residential unit sales were down 62 per cent to 2,707 units during the same period. The average MLS® residential price in the province was $395,687, down 12.5 per cent from November 2007.

“The average sale price of a home in the province hit a 26-month low in November,” said Cameron Muir, BCREA Chief Economist. “The irony of markets is that there’s no shortage of buyers when prices are near a peak and a scarcity of buyers when prices are near a trough.” Home prices were 8 per cent lower in November 2008—nine months after the peak—than they were nine months prior to the peak.

“Today’s homebuyers are benefiting from a greater selection of homes for sale, more time to thoroughly investigate their choices and the ability to negotiate attractive prices,” added Muir.

Year-to-date MLS® residential sales dollar volume in the province declined 30 per cent to $30.3 billion compared to the same period last year. Provincial MLS® sales declined 32 per cent to 66,467 units, while the average residential price increased 4 per cent to $455,537 over the same period.

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For more information, please contact:
Cameron Muir
Chief Economist
Direct: 604.742.2780
Mobile: 778.229.1884
Email: cmuir@bcrea.bc.ca

BCREA represents 12 member real estate boards and their more than 17,500 REALTORS® on all provincial issues, providing an extensive communications network, standard forms, government relations, required post-licensing courses and continuing education.

Kelowna Market Update: Fall 2008

Brock Thorvaldson — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 18:54:00 GMT

A note to all future buyers, investors and clients

The Kelowna Market

By Brock Thorvaldson

Over the past few quarters of 2008 we have seen quite a change in the dynamics of the real estate market in and around the Kelowna area. In the preceding 4 years house prices in the valley had doubled and we became one of the most expensive places to live in the country. In reality we should be at the upper range for house prices, based on what Kelowna has to offer. It is arguable that Kelowna and Victoria should be in that upper bracket based on their aesthetic value and population statistics. Kelowna is one of the fastest growing cities in Canada. The population is forecasted to double from it's current population of just over 100,000 by 2020, giving us a lot hope for the future of our city.

When looking at this years statistics we do have to keep in mind that 2007 was a record year. The boom had to slow down at some point in order to keep Kelowna prices from escalating out of control. As we look ahead we have to consider the following key points in today’s economy:

As you know, there are major financial problems in the United States that affects us greatly. This is due to the fact that many U.S investors are either not in a position to look, or they are looking locally for deals given the foreclosure situation. The influence for local Canadian purchasers to buy and invest in real estate in the U.S. has now become a common trend. The uncertainty in the housing and stock markets in the U.S has made an impact on the Canadian purchaser. The Alberta markets have slowed lately which lowers the investment dollars comming in from our neighbors to the East. The slow here has more to do with situations elewhere than with what is happening here. This situation will inevitably turn around and will not be a major issue given the population growth the Okanagan is able to sustain and all the other attractions that we enjoy here.

The 2010 Olympic games will bring much visibility to our beautiful city and likely entice investors from the world over. Over the next decade Kelowna is going to grow a great deal. Even over the past 10 years we have seen dramatic changes throughout our city, with growing developments as well as business’s and even the new bridge. Feel free to visit www.kelowna.ca and click on projects to view various plans to dramatically alter the downtown core with marinas, walkways and giant fountains. Kelowna is starting to dress up for the occasion and we can expect that home prices will certainly go up again in the near future.

Right now we are seeing many homes that are not selling and agents are either encouraging people to lower their prices or the listings are expiring on the market due to overpricing. It is becoming more and more of a buyers market as people are sacrificing their prices in order to get their home sold over the inflated competition. I believe as the fall approaches and into the winter we will see prices at very healthy levels for the average buyer. In Spring the prices will be similar to what they are now, as I expect we won’t see much increase from now till then. Prices always go up a little bit in the spring so now may be the right time to buy. In the future prices will rise again to reflect the popularity of the area and the ever increasing population growth.

At this time, you can find homes for 300K (base price in the market) which was a rarity a year ago. I am encouraging any buyers who have been watching and waiting that now is a great time to start to get serious about taking advantage of this current situation. From an investors standpoint there are very good income returns in the market because people who are forced to sell due to situations such as job transfers etc. are pricing their homes at very fair levels. People looking for investments would be wise to purchase now at this low period as the future looks positive for growth in the market over the next 5 years.

Although some homes are selling for low prices it is now essential that you evaluate all aspects of the home to ensure that the value is really there. Homes with good curb appeal, large lot sizes and new features are always in demand. In this market you may be able to pick up something for a bargain, but if it doesn’t have any curb appeal or a nice layout then it’s going to be hard to sell down the line without a lot of time, work and money.

Every purchaser is looking for something that will work for them and have the potential to become a strong investment down the line. It isn’t always a smart decision to buy something because it is advertised as ‘recently reduced by 20K’, although these listings are obviously ones to evaluate and consider very carefully. When you decide to move forward in making a purchase in today’s market, I will focus in and evaluate every option for you in detail. I will strive to make sure we find something that fits your needs, pocketbook and lifestyle.

Thanks for taking the time to read my email and please contact me with any feedback and/or questions. I would be happy to receive any information on where you are with your plans as well as any timeframes you may have in respect to your future real estate investment.

RE/MAX of Western Canada (1998) Inc. Affordability report, issued April 22, 2008

Brock Thorvaldson — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 18:16:00 GMT

Rising housing values and lack of inventory

challenge first-time buyers, says RE/MAX

“Homeownership continues to be primary objective”

While higher housing values and tight inventory levels have hampered home-buying activity so far this year, longer amortization periods and alternative housing types have offset the impact on most major markets across the country, according to a report released today by RE/MAX.

Despite a higher degree of frustration in the marketplace than in previous years, the RE/MAX Affordability Report found that first-time buyers, in particular, remain steadfast in their determination to purchase a home. In fact, entry-level purchasers are adjusting their expectations by sacrificing size, location, and even long-term financial freedom, to overcome challenges such as rising prices and serious supply issues. Innovative financing has become key to homeownership in today’s environment – with longer amortization periods gaining favour in 62 per cent of the major centres surveyed. Low or no down payments were popular with first-time buyers in 38 per cent of markets.

First-time purchasers continue to play a pivotal role at both a local and national level. The impact they have on the housing market is significant, as they are the impetus for sales in the mid-to-upper price ranges. As long as this segment of the market remains healthy, the real estate outlook will continue to be favourable.

Inventory levels, however, remain one of the foremost concerns facing purchasers across the country. A shortage of available entry-level product was identified as a major obstacle impeding buyer intentions in three-quarters of markets surveyed in the report, including St. John’s, Moncton, Fredericton, Halifax-Dartmouth, Ottawa, Greater Toronto Area, Hamilton-Burlington, Niagara Falls, Winnipeg, Regina, Saskatoon, Greater Vancouver, Victoria and Kelowna.

Doom and gloom reports coming from south of the border have yet to hinder overall momentum. First-time buyers are still leading the charge, taking advantage of every resource available to achieve homeownership. They’re determined to get into the market sooner rather than later. If suburban locations, smaller condominiums and town homes, or a little sweat equity is what it takes to get into the market, these purchasers are game.

Although average price is the barometer for housing values in most major centres, first-time buyers looking to achieve homeownership consider starting prices a more meaningful gauge of affordability. Starting prices can be substantially lower than the market average. For example, average price has surpassed the $600,000 benchmark in Greater Vancouver, while the starting price for a detached home can hover as low as $237,500 in the peripheral areas.

The best value for the dollar continues to be found in the suburbs. For those unwilling to sacrifice on location, small condominium units in new developments and condominium conversions of rental buildings offer up the next best alternative. Condominium conversions in some of the country’s major centres can be picked up as low as $150,000 to $175,000.

Kelowna Market

First-time buyers are adjusting their expectations, considering alternate locations, and opting for longer amortization periods to realize homeownership in Kelowna this year. With average price approaching the half million dollar mark, entry-level purchasers are finding it more and more difficult to enter the housing market without compromise. Just 213 units—29 per cent— have sold under the average price point so far this year. While inventory levels have improved overall, compared to one year ago, there is still a shortage of starter properties listed for sale. The city’s most affordable

neighbourhoods include Kelowna North, where starting prices for a three-bedroom home hover at $334,500, Springfield/Spall at $239,000, Rutland South at $307,750, Rutland North at $299,000, and Kelowna South at $369,900. Less expensive properties are available in these communities if purchasers are willing to consider two bedroom and semi-detached homes. Condominium popularity continues to surge due to affordability, with first-time buyers leading the charge for product. Demand has been so strong that a recent condominium conversion in Bridgewater, Lower Mission sold out before it went public. A one-bedroom condominium can be purchased for as low as $149,900 in Westbank, $155,000 in North Glenmore, $159,900 in Kelowna South, $172,900 in Rutland North, and $203,500 in Glenmore.

The least expensive MLS detached home sale year-todate was priced at $242,000 in Kelowna North, while a condo sale at $145,000 was the lowest so far this year in Rutland North.

1st quarter 2008

Brock Thorvaldson — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 17:28:00 GMT

1st quarter statistics for the Central Okanagan show that prices have risen over last year in all housing categories. Year-to date average sale prices are up 15% for residential properties, with apartment condos leading the way with 16.7% increases. Townhouses are up 13.5%, mobile homes 8.9% and lots 4.84%.

2008 has seen more listings hit the market than the same period last year, an 18.5% increase. Sales however, are down by 16% overall. Mobile homes seem to be the only category bucking this trend showing an 6.6% increase in sales over last year. I am seeing an increase in interest in mobile homes and lower priced condominiums due to their affordability. On average residential properties are taking 66 days to sell, which is similar to last year.

Prices are up, but this is not uniform for all areas. Certain areas are seeing a much greater increase in prices than others. So if appreciation is your goal, you need to focus on those sub-divisions. Give me a call and we can discuss how to get you into the home most suitable for your needs.

Kelowna Real Estate Forecast

Brock Thorvaldson — Fri, 25 Jan 2008 21:48:00 GMT

Slow and steady growth forecast for residential real estate

Canadian home sales to top 500,000 in 2007

Kelowna, BC (October 17, 2007)—After posting extraordinary gains in 2007, housing market performance will moderate in most major Canadian centres in 2008, according to a report released today by RE/MAX.

The RE/MAX Housing Market Outlook 2008 examined residential real estate trends in 18 markets across the country. The report found that while economic prospects will continue to improve next year, few major markets are expected to exceed record sales levels set in 2007. Winnipeg, Hamilton-Burlington, Kitchener-Waterloo, London-St. Thomas, Ottawa, Sudbury, Saint John, Halifax-Dartmouth, and St. John’s are all predicted to buck the trend in 2008, with appreciation ranging from one to seven per cent. Average price is forecast to increase in 78 per cent of markets surveyed next year, with the lowest price increase expected in Edmonton and the highest in St. John’s.

Nationally, the number of homes sold is expected to break through the half-million threshold in 2007, climbing 13 per cent to an estimated 545,400 units, up from 483,770 units one year ago. Average price is projected to appreciate nine per cent to $303,000, up about $25,000 over 2006 levels. In 2008, home sales are expected to retreat to 500,000 units while Canadian housing values are forecast to continue their ascent, rising six per cent to $321,000.

“Clearly, economic prosperity has translated into increased housing sales and upward pressure on prices across the board,” says Elton Ash, Regional Executive Vice President, RE/MAX of Western Canada. “The country’s economic engine fired on all cylinders throughout the year, despite dire conditions south of the border. As in 2007, inventory will be the major wildcard next year—the ultimate variable most expected to influence housing market conditions and performance. A return to tight market conditions could mean all bets are off as buyers are forced to compete, creating increased market pressure.”

Major market frontrunners for price appreciation in 2008 include St. John’s (12 per cent), Regina and Kelowna – Central Okanagan (nine per cent), Hamilton-Burlington and Saint John (eight per cent) and Greater Vancouver (seven per cent). Leading the country in sales growth next year will be Kitchener-Waterloo (seven per cent), followed by Hamilton-Burlington, London-St. Thomas, Sudbury and Halifax-Dartmouth, each forecasting a five per cent gain.

Higher mortgage rates and increased inventory levels failed to materialize in most major centres, making 2007 a record year for real estate activity in Canada. By year-end, housing values across the country are expected to shatter existing records. Serious double-digit increases in average price are forecasted for Saskatoon (49), Edmonton (31.5), Regina (21), Calgary (20), Sudbury (20), Kelowna (19.5) Saint John (17), St. John’s (12), and Greater Vancouver (10).

Saskatchewan dominated real estate news in 2007, reporting some of the highest percentage increases in unit sales. The number of homes sold in Regina by year-end is expected to top 35 per cent, bringing sales to an estimated 4,000 units. Neighbouring Saskatoon is forecast to climb 28 per cent to 4,400 units in 2007. Other centres expected to post double-digit gains in activity include Saint John (19 per cent) Kitchener-Waterloo (13 per cent), Halifax-Dartmouth (12 per cent), St. John’s (11 per cent), and Toronto (10 per cent).

“Western markets were first out of the gate in 2007, but those in the East followed suit,” says Michael Polzler, Executive Vice President and Regional Director, RE/MAX Ontario-Atlantic Canada. “By year-end, some of the most impressive gains in home sales will be realized in Ontario and Atlantic Canada. Solid economic fundamentals, including billions of dollars in capital projects, a positive unemployment outlook, and solid consumer confidence levels will propel markets forward. A slow and steady growth trajectory, minus the peaks and valleys experienced in 2007, is forecast for next year.”

RE/MAX is Canada's leading real estate organization with over 17,500 sales associates situated throughout its more than 640 independently owned and operated offices across the country. The RE/MAX franchise network, now in its 34th year of consecutive growth, is a global real estate system operating in over 65 countries. More than 7,000 independently owned offices engage 120,000 member sales associates who lead the industry in professional designations, experience and production while providing real estate services in residential, commercial, referral and asset management. For more information, visit: www.remax.ca.

RE/MAX Official Condo Report

Brock Thorvaldson — Tue, 20 Nov 2007 23:21:00 GMT

Condominiums achieve unprecedented favour

among Canadian homebuyers, says RE/MAX

Double-digit sales gains reported in most major markets in 2007

Kelowna, BC (November 14, 2007) -- After more than three decades of slow but steady growth, the condominium concept has finally clicked with Canadian homeowners. The lifestyle has proven to be a solid investment in housing markets across the country, chalking up some of the most impressive gains in residential real estate in 2007, according to the RE/MAX Condominium Report released today.

Their universal appeal is substantiated, with every market reporting increased momentum in condominium sales volume over 2006 levels. In fact, 80 per cent of markets surveyed reported double-digit gains in sales year-over-year, with 53 per cent reporting increases over 20 per cent. The greatest growth was experienced in Canada’s small to mid-sized markets. Leading the country, in terms of percentage increase in sales so far this year, are Kitchener-Waterloo (+59%), Regina (+57%), St. John’s (+54%), and Saskatoon (+33%).

“The white picket fence, sprawling green lawn and tidy urban bungalow has become an unattainable ideal for many first-time buyers—especially in the West,” says Elton Ash, Regional Executive Vice President, RE/MAX of Western Canada. “By necessity, condominiums have become the only practical means to homeownership for a growing segment of the population. Today’s entry-level purchasers aspire to manageable mortgage payments, sunset city views, and the non-stop action and amenities of central core living, all packed into 600 to 800 sq. ft. The momentum of the market in recent decades has redefined the home buying process.”

While price appreciation on freehold properties, in particular, was the primary factor in the upswing, the strong desire among baby boomers to lead an active, carefree lifestyle has also driven the concept to unprecedented popularity. The RE/MAX Condominium Report identified Greater Vancouver as the strongest market in the country – where close to 60 per cent of all residential sales now involve a condominium. Condominium presence is also on the rise in centres such as Toronto, Edmonton, Calgary, Regina, Ottawa, and Hamilton-Burlington, where condos now represent 20 to 30 per cent of all MLS sales.

“Deteriorating affordability levels in major Canadian centres have lead to the resurrection of the condominium lifestyle in recent years,” says Michael Polzler, Executive Vice President, Regional Director, RE/MAX Ontario-Atlantic Canada. “Condominiums are clearly the answer to the skyrocketing cost of land and shelter that has all but eradicated the dream of homeownership for many first-time buyers.”

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RE/MAX Condominium Report 2007…2

Condominium values were also up from coast-to-coast in 2007, with all major markets reporting an increase in average price. Thirty-three per cent of cities surveyed reported double-digit price appreciation. The most dramatic hikes were seen in Western Canada’s red-hot housing markets, led by Saskatoon (+24%), Calgary (+22%), Edmonton (+19%), Kelowna (+16 % for town homes, +12% for apartments), Vancouver (+14 % for town homes, +11% for apartments), and Victoria (+9% for town homes, +12% for apartments).

At the top end of the market, condominium ownership has been equated with lifestyle. Throughout 2007, aging baby boomers fuelled demand for luxury condominium units. Upper-end activity was reported to be on the rise in all markets examined, with the greatest appreciation occurring in Edmonton (+154 %), Greater Toronto (+98 %), Victoria (+85 %), Winnipeg (+58%), Vancouver (+49%) and Kitchener-Waterloo (+39%). The maintenance-free factor, the ability to travel and to enjoy the best the city has to offer—from restaurants to recreation—were citied in overall condominium appeal.

“In years past, there seemed to be a ceiling in terms of what buyers were willing to pay for this type of product,” says Polzler. “Widespread acceptance has seen that philosophy tossed out the window. In the upper-end especially, buyers have demonstrated a willingness to set new benchmarks, and in some cases, are spending more than what a detached home might cost. Multiple offers, once unheard of, have become a reality in some centres.”

New benchmarks for the most expensive apartment-style condominium units ever sold through MLS have been reported in several cities in 2007, including Vancouver ($18 million), Calgary ($3.7 million), Edmonton ($2.3 million), Winnipeg ($1.25 million), and Kitchener-Waterloo ($670,000).

Given solid demand through all price ranges, it comes as no surprise that investors have been very active in the majority of markets surveyed, hoping to snap up a piece of the pie while demand remains at peak levels. Yet, with a growing number looking for a quick return on investment, swelling inventory levels have become a serious concern in several markets, most notably in Calgary and Edmonton, and to a much lesser extent, Kelowna.

“The impact of speculation, especially in Canada’s largest condominium markets, have yet to be determined, but concerns for the future are relevant,” says Ash. “In downtown Vancouver, an estimated 50 per cent of sales activity is attributed to investors, whereas as much as 60-85 per cent of new condominiums sales in Toronto’s downtown core reportedly involved investors in 2007. This is a major factor that could influence prices in years to come.”

For now, a number of market fundamentals point to increased growth in sales, prices and demand well into 2008. These include vibrant economies, Canada’s aging population, rising prices, and higher levels of immigration, to name a few.

RE/MAX is Canada's leading real estate organization with over 17,500 sales associates situated throughout its more than 640 independently owned and operated offices across the country. The RE/MAX franchise network, now in its 34th year, is a global real estate system operating in over 65 countries. More than 7,000 independently owned offices engage more than 115,000 member sales associates who lead the industry in professional designations, experience and production while providing real estate services in residential, commercial, referral and asset management.

To find out more about your market check out the full report

www.remax-western.ca/resources/remaxcondo.pdf

Condominiums drive the Kelowna market

Brock Thorvaldson — Thu, 06 Sep 2007 19:23:00 GMT

At September 30, 2007, the Kelowna market sales volume was up 34% over 2006. The number of units sold was up over 13%. What is driving these increases? Condominiums! Not only are a large number of projects being built, they are selling because they are affordable. Kelowna is highly regarded as a retirement destination and many baby boomers want to invest now, even if their retirement is off in the future. Condominiums are the investment choice. For young people, it is the only choice as average house prices pass the half million dollar mark. Both townhouses and apartment condominiums are selling with median prices of $327,000 and $239,900 respectively. So, if you are one of those people looking to move to one of the fastest growing and most beautiful places in the world let me be your guide and help you to find the perfect retreat for you and your family in this amazing location.

If you can't wait to enjoy the Okanagan lifestyle, talk to Brock.